Gunners Get Off Lightly in Germany (2024)

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1. 3 more years of this sh*te

   Sep 18, 2014, 22:33 #57608

   What was the point in leaving Highbury?- I know how you feel. Every time I allow myself to imagine the glorious day that we are finally free of Wenger's depressing philosophies, my joy is checked by the thought that his negative influence might cast a shadow over the club for at least another decade. Chilling, isn't it?

2. What was the point in leaving Highbury?

   Sep 18, 2014, 18:56 #57599

   When Wenger finally goes it will be one the happiest and most worrying days of my life. Happy he has gone but terrified he has picked who will replace him and then sit above him. Could actually be worse with him on the board. Hope he just clears off with a nice clean break

3. DJ

   Sep 18, 2014, 17:10 #57591

   The trouble with Wenger is he is too stubborn. He won all his trophies, bar this last FA Cup, with Vieira in his midfield a true warrior. Now he seems obsessed with this romantic ideal of playing without a recognised destroyer and winning through style over substance. This would be fine if the other teams agreed to follow suit but the nasty beggars seem hell bent on closing down and tackling our brave boys. As many have said I dislike the way our manager has become a laughing stock and wish he would leave with his dignity intact but leave he must.

4. BringBackDene

   Sep 18, 2014, 16:51 #57590

   We will fail to get 4th spot in the league, which seems highly likely, and blown out of the Champs League a dead cert. Only then will the board wake up and sack "Le mental strength"

5. Bard

   Sep 18, 2014, 16:35 #57589

   Nick T, I agree with your overall gist which is that when the manager loses the players he is done for. Im not sure that is the case just yet. I dont agree with the RVP analysis. We dont really know what went on but we sold him for a good amount of money and he got a 5 year contract plus a shedload of money for moving to the Mancs. It was painful but a good deal for both sides, whether he had a gripe with Wenger we dont know but Im sure the money and length of contract were bigger incentives.

6. maguiresbridge gooner

   Sep 18, 2014, 14:19 #57586

   MARCUS, the old fraud been sacked will do for now.

7. Hi Berry

   Sep 18, 2014, 14:09 #57585

   Nick T - my thoughts entirely on the Fabregas situation. It would have been a shame for him to come back to Arsenal and end up as frustrated as many others before....himself included a few years ago. I don't begrudge him moving to Chelsea in the slightest and didn't RVP to Man Utd. I think you only had to see RVP's obvious joy and exclamation of 'at last' (if I remember correctly) when receiving his Premiership Winners medal two years ago to know top players want something tangible to show for their undoubted skills. On the other hand Nickolas Bendtner was quite happy to sit on his backside for £50K a week.

8. KC

   Sep 18, 2014, 13:58 #57584

   RadfordKennedy - Good post, Westlower - Its not losing its how we lose and how the weaknesses are not addressed again and again, I want us to win / compete for the league and champions league we now have the money but Wengers refusal to address the obvious will stop us competing. Any team can be poor, get beaten, not turn up etc but to keep doing it and to do it away from home shows weakness mentally as well as weakness tacticlly. Sadly I now accept he will never turn it around, last season the heavy defeats were huniliating at the very least, to then turn up at Dortmund and be lucky to lose by only two was again proof that our manager has not learnt or addressed anything defensively. Thats shameful.

9. Tony Evans

   Sep 18, 2014, 13:55 #57583

   If the football gossip columns are to be believed we are now scratching around in the Freebie market for a defender and possibly a defensive midfielder. It was screamingly obvious to all and sundry (bar Wenger) that we were desperately short at the back, even before a ball was kicked this season, but old clot head did nothing about it. He gets away with these appalling gaffes because the board are implicit in the malaise that is Arsenal FC (or PLC should I say) and until someone like Usmanov takes the helm nothing will change.

10. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 18, 2014, 13:53 #57582

    Lord Froth 60827, that's exactly what the wengerites think all fans should be doing (not just themselves) and would love to see.

11. jeff wright

    Sep 18, 2014, 13:39 #57581

    Hiccup ,jjetplane it is becoming more embarrassing than comical watching the attempted excuses by the AKB's to try and defend the indefensible . It's gone past the stage where the little boy shouts out ,look mum le emperor is not wearing any clothes ! The rest of the crowd have now joined in as well .

12. Ed l

    Sep 18, 2014, 13:15 #57580

    Arsenal FC are a top table football club who should at least be competitive at the highest points of club football. We don t expect them to win but we want them to do their best and maximise their resources. We would hope they would think strategically, tactically and buy players they needed. Additionally they should work to a budget and not overextend the club financially. Ideally OGL uses just in time management to blend future stars into a team whilst maximising the resale of ageing stalwarts. In reality he employs a dithering too f**king late approach, no tactics ,buys randomly like a sales shopper and keeps more in reserves financially than the whole of the rest of the league. Why are AFC paying £8m a year for a finance director when they actually need a football manager?To those of you who moan about being taken for mugs, stop going. This is now my 3rd season without a season ticket and I don t miss it.

13. jeff wright

    Sep 18, 2014, 13:04 #57579

    I just tell it as I see it GBP and as I see it Arsene is a repeat offender getting caught every-time he tries to nick a result against a top side. I don't see any relevance at all in the other English clubs results against Euro opponents last night to that fact. I watched the Chelsea game and thought without Costa that they looked the same as last season -when he made his appearance to replace Drogba- who looks a shadow of his former self- things picked up and Chelsea could have won the game but they didn't . They still played a million times better than we did the night before though. It was amusing to hear Wenger and then some of his faithful little lambs bleating about Danny Boy missing 3 chances,as though this was unusual, but if we allow for those chances to be chalked up as goals then we have to do the same with Klopp's krauts ones -so er,lets see now hmm, Klopp 23 Arsene 3 ... actually the worrying thing is that this could easily have been the score! You couldn't make it up. Regarding Villa t looks tricky but they are a counter-attacking side so no doubt Arse will take account of that and play deep to try and draw them out,rather than high-line gung - ho let's see if the fools can score more goals than us .Then again.... he probably will go gunge-ho ho .Why should he go changing the habits of a lifetime ? Perhaps a look at the way England beat Swizzland with Jack playing deep and Danny Boy on his loneseome up front might help - but tbh I am really jut expecting the same old again from Wenger and us needing a bit of good fortune again to get a result against the Villains who will start the fresher and be well up for the fray .

14. jjetplane

    Sep 18, 2014, 12:58 #57578

    Well researched there JEFF! Along with the AKB goalposts forever moving, looks like the dark side has too. Wenger and his troubled apostles look like the only unsettled negatives on here. Think Wenger (always the professor/never the football manager) has lost the team and nowhere is that more visible than the antics of Podolski over the course of the other night. Some of those Germans out on the pitch were actively embarrassed by his complete lack professionalism in front of all those fans. Klopp had a slightly ragged team out which was why he clapped so encouragingly those players who put in a shift and in time will be putting those chances away. Someone has mentioned 'what has happened to Ramsay?' Look at the picture of fatal bemusem*nt on his face before the match began. Who was acting the c... beside him - who do you think? A Bendtner type attitude is alive at the current set-up and nothing but a major shake-up is going to rid this disease from a once great ****ing club! It almost seemed for a moment that things can not get even more shambolic but this newer more disturbing phase - BD could have scored 10! is shocking to see! Even more shocking if Wenger does not make some kind of positive noise soon that excludes the poncey spin of 'good spirit'. Just go! 18 years is easily 10 too long. Come on Scotland!

15. Hiccup

    Sep 18, 2014, 12:52 #57577

    Jeff, so true. When City put 6 past us last year, they said it was down to their financial muscle. When Stoke beat them last week, they said it proved that spend, spend, spend doesn't guarantee success. They lose last night and they now say they have sh*t players. They feel the need to come on here and defend wenger so badly, that yet again the place has gone in to contradiction meltdown. And now Shankly and Paisley are being dragged down to cater for their arguments? Jesus wept!

16. Hiccup

    Sep 18, 2014, 12:31 #57576

    Pete, great point you raise. You are one step ahead. I mentioned awful players like almunia and bendtner that wenger persevered with for years and had to wait until their contracts expired to get rid of. You mention players part of the invincible team and give wenger credit for selling these players? You applaud wenger for dismantling the invincibles? While we're at it, I suppose he did a great job selling on cesc, nasri and RVP?

17. WENGER MUST GO ASAP(MARCUS)

    Sep 18, 2014, 12:09 #57573

    I see it did not take the delusional akbs to come out the woodwork and defend their messiah. You guys clearly support arsene FC and not arsenal.

18. GBP

    Sep 18, 2014, 12:04 #57572

    ..... and just when we thought things had settled on the OLG site Jeff arrives. Good old Jeff, but your only 'consistency' is in your venom for Wenger. Anyway, on your Villa point, 1-1 or dare i say it, 1-0 Villa? Theyre well overdue a win v Gunners there. 1998 the last one. We re struggling.

19. jeff wright

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:55 #57571

    Amazing how the AKB's rating of City swings from 'champions' to chumps playing with 3 left feet and two toes missing ... one day after we drew at home with them they are a 'well oiled machine' who we went toe to toe with to being not good enough along with the other Prem clubs to win in Europe ! Consistency of argument is never a strong point of the AKB in their struggle to defend old outdated out out played regularly by top sides Arsene, but desperate times demand desperate measures with more tree wheel turns and screeching wheelies being performed than we see Hollywood stuntmen perform. . What's you tip for Villa away then Westie?

20. Red Member

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:52 #57570

    where Wenger has always survived is that the club has little blips and then bounces back to go on a little run. I just get the feeling that this seaso may be different though. So far we have played 7 games and struggled in every one of those. I can't remember a time under Wenger where that has been the case. And the games are not going to be very easy these next few weeks...

21. Bard

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:36 #57569

    Wenger must GO, I share some of your sentiments but I dont agree that Wenger will remain in post for the foreseeable future. However stupid we think the board are, they will have a good idea of what goes on. I dont believe either that a half empty stadium will make a difference because there wont be one. It will always be moreorless full. What will make a difference in my view is if the fans get nasty as during the Villa game last season.

22. GBP

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:31 #57567

    Nick - lots of ways to look at the RVP issue. It seesm that discussions with RVP led to him being told that the Club cdt then fund buying the type of players RVP wd have liked. Ive no beef with RVP either. He left for an enormous pay hike. AFC did an ok deal though. RVP gave Utd a stellar season and won the title on his own. We got 24 Million in a market where no other Club wanted to pay too much for him bar Utd. He looks now to be back where he was with us for 7 years fitness wise. AFC knew they were letting a player go whos fitness was always going to come back and plague him. It was a decent deal i thought. Had he have stayed he may be struggling with us as he is now with Utd seemingly and with no real prospect of a good sale price? Not sure of his contract there but with the new buys at Utd, they could have a Bendtner situ to deal with, a non player on enormous salary who they cant shift. Utd have a few of them already.

23. GBP

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:16 #57566

    True Ramgun. Not an insult though. Ive read a book of Bob Ps (or a biography, i forget now) and he said himself that his men in the bootroom at Anfield with him were the motivators and movers in his last few years. Its a good point that you make though. Glad you picked up on it.

24. DJ

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:11 #57565

    Westlower: It isn’t the defeat that is important, it is the manner of the defeat. Time and time again we are beaten heavily away to the top teams at home and in Europe. Not being set up properly, not working hard enough and not buying a defensive midfielder has got to be the responsibility of the manager. We will get behind the team at Villa Park and at home to Spurs the week after it is not the supporters fault the same mistakes keep happening.

25. Bard

    Sep 18, 2014, 11:08 #57564

    Westie, thats a slightly disingenuous post. To reduce all the negative comments on here as not being able to cope with losing is missing the point by a country mile. We didnt just lose we were thrashed. We were tactically, physically, technically a poor second. If you think that constitutes just a loss then I dont know what game you were watching. It wasnt a bad day at the office either. It was clear evidence that despite a fairly active transfer window we are the same team that got spanked last season. Wenger hasnt been able to resolve the problems. At the very least a manager has to be able to put a side out who will shed blood for the cause. If they do that and lose so be it. Youve watched too much football for me to be convinced that you really believe what you have posted.

26. Nick T

    Sep 18, 2014, 10:56 #57563

    Agree with almost all of the points made on here so not going to go over old ground but what I wanted to say was I think its the players and the relationships they have with AW thats most concerning and the biggest indicator of how far Project Wenger has veered off course. For me the single most significant moment regarding Wenger in recent times was the RVP saga. Its one thing when supposed expert pundits and fans alike voice strong opinions about the manager/vision of the club but another when it comes from your star player who has a first hand insight into goings on behind the scenes. His true fustration first surfaced in that game against the mancs when AW substituted Ox and it was plain to see RVP was thinking 'what the hell are you doing?!'. Then he openly stated in the summer that he'd had a chat with Wenger and decided he didnt want to stick around....that is a truly damming statement especially when it comes from your only world class player (at the time). There are different slants on what really happened but I honestly believe he simply thought he had no chance to win big trophies with Arsenal and like any ambitious, quality player without medals or time on his side decided he had to get out. Hes a Utd player because he didnt want to stay at Arsenal NOT because he wanted to go to Utd - he could never state it in those terms at his press conference for obvious reasons (!) hence the 'little boy' PR bollocks etc... but I dont doubt his reasons were genuine and dont hold it against him. If this wasnt bad enough then theres the issue of letting him go to that lot....I could maybe have got my head round it a little more if we had got crazy money for him but we didnt....good value for money to our former great PL rivals and AW tops it off telling Fergie 'hes better than you think'!!! If their relationship had become untenable and he had to go thats one thing but surely flog him abroad or just play hardball and refuse to sell, Im sure once he knew he wasnt going to get a move he would have had a rethink and just got on playing for Arsenal regardless....Suarez ring any bells? - he wanted out yet it didnt seem to hinder him last season (!) and like f*ck Liverpool were ever going to sell him to us. Fast forward to Fabregas this summmer and Ive read a lot of comments about how AW was mad not to take up the option on him....but how do you know he didnt try?? Perhaps he had a chat with Fabregas who simply stated he really didnt want to come back to Arsenal (as Mourinho stated no doubt on a bit of a wind up but perhaps also true?), option or no option are you really going to take a player back who fundamentally doesnt want to return? That one is mere speculation but I do think the biggest issue these days is that the players themselves, certain ones in particular, may well have lost faith with Wenger and once that happens your in big trouble. I would love to know what Ozil really thinks about the current situation - he's a bit lazy no doubt but quite why you invest 42m in a player and not use him in his preferred position is beyond me, most gooners Id imagine and I suspect Ozil himself!!

27. Ramgun

    Sep 18, 2014, 10:52 #57562

    GBP - You are wrong about Shankly and Paisley. In shankly's last two seasons Liverpool won the League, Uefa Cup and the FA Cup. In Paisley's last two seasons Liverpool did the League Championship and League Cup Double in both seasons! It is an insult to those two great managers to say they had anything in common with the charlatan currently managing Arsenal.

28. Westlower

    Sep 18, 2014, 10:44 #57561

    Losing a game under the next manager will be just as painful as losing under the present one. I doubt that some of you will change your outlook regardless of who is in the hot seat. Will you cope any better with future defeats?

29. Red Member

    Sep 18, 2014, 10:01 #57560

    what you have to remember is that Wenger for 17 years in a row now has done his job perfectly (in the eyes of the board)He even managed to achieve over and above this last season by winning the FA Cup. For this he has been handsomely rewarded with a 3 year contract. Maybe more pressure should be put on the board to increase the ambition of the club. Wenger does what he is asked to do year after year.

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30. GBP

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:47 #57559

    Mat - Its a fair comment. I simply look at the contract in the same way i do player contracts. Clubs sign up their best men on long deals to max the price if they sell within the term of the contract and in many cases they know that the contract wont see its natural end. In Wengers case he knows that if he goes within it he gets a good severance too. History tells us that if a Coach says that hes leaving at a pre set time, its bad for the Club. Players lose the will to listen to the Coach and performances dip sharply and permanently. Fergie in 02 is the best eg of this. Even he became a dead man walking at that time until he reversed his decision to retire. With Wengers contract as i see it,it allows the Club to make the transition from him to his successor without the clock ticking so quickly. When the time arrives the Club and Wenger can then sever his contract 'by mutual agreement'. Its all looks and presents better for the Club and more importantly so for the Clubs sponsors all of whom want to see stability maintained. Arsenal are known for this type of continuity in the main. The panic and knee jerk type management you see at many other Clubs has rarely been seen at the Club.

31. N4

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:37 #57558

    @GBP, surely AW can show a bit more than 4th if that's part of his contract deal! He instead struggles between 5th and 4th which luck somehow manage to get him 4th...!

32. GBP

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:34 #57557

    It doesn't make the defeat 'OK' reboot but it puts it in perspective. Man C, Chelsea and Man U have all taken similar CL defeats as we did in the last 12 to 18 months. PL Clubs aren't at the races in the CL tight now and havent been for a few years.

33. Mathew

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:30 #57556

    GBP, great analysis, but how would you justify his extension of contract for another 3 years. If he is expecting his successor to take us to the next level, he should've identified one and stepped down with grace.

34. N4

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:16 #57555

    What I don't get is people come on here trying once more to say positive things about AW by his past success and things he has endured as a coach etc... Firstly, AW doesn't do for free which means he gets good money for it in return! More money than all of us on here put together what we make in a year!!! People are confused of whether they supporters of Arsenal FC or Arsène FC. What we are the stupid ones who's fighting each other on here what is best for the club or not...because until today AW has yet to come out and say it's my fault for the result of 2 days ago, I am the one that wanted to endure the stringent club economy, I'm the one that wanted to stay longer(for whatever reason...), I am the one that doesn't speak enough to the fans why I do not want to spend or buy players that we need etc... He knows he doesn't need to answer us any questions... The board will not get rid of him surely not when the season has just started! He makes them money by taking risk and he knows that he things don't work he will be the one to take the burden...and the funny he only needs to answer a few board ball-less (if that's a word...) members! I think most people will agree even with the last result if AW come out like a man to fans and apologise and explain something! Not repeating his mantra comments that he says to the TV all the time.

35. GBP

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:11 #57554

    Hi Berry - Yours is a reasonable view to take. The fact is that we dont know how the lines are drawn in the corridors of the Club. We can just assume and guess. Hes a bloke with a lot of resolve im sure so we would probabaly have to slip considerably before he would truly lose his own belief. The Club seem to have deemed that a top 4 placing is our ceiling at the moment and like it or not Wenger keeps delivering hence his contract. Not sure too many other Clubs would see where we are as 'sad' though. Most of the Clubs here would kill for what Arsenal have. I would guess that AW accepts that to raise our bar from where we are will be the task of his successor though.

36. reboot

    Sep 18, 2014, 9:03 #57553

    The only thing more predictable than Arsenals defeat at Dortmund is one of his worshipers coming on here pointing out that the other English teams didn't do very well. Some how that makes the nature of our defeat ok?

37. radfordkennedy

    Sep 18, 2014, 8:59 #57552

    I dont post as much as i once did simply because i get bored with the constant slanging matches between the Wenger in/out factions.For the record i do believe its time for AW to go not because he is an idiot or a charlatan or even some of the more colourful words used against him but simply because he evidently cannot motivate plan or coach to the very highest levels anymore.This isnt a knee jerk reaction as some would say but purely an observation and an opinion based on many years watching Arsenal.Even the master tactition Don Howe once said there came a time when the players had heard every gee up and rousing teamtalk he had in his repertoire and it was no longer having an effect.If everyone was really honest with themselves we have been ars#hole lucky so far this season a last gasp win over Palace going 2 down against an average Everton side and pulling it back at the death failing to beat the mighty Foxes after leading and lets be really honest here against city it could of ended 3-6 and as for Dortmund if it wasnt for the better chances falling to that Armenian fella whose name i cant remember it could of been another half dozen.There is something very wrong at our great club we have it all there and waiting to go up to the next level and truly compete.The board are not stupid they know the tide of opinion is turning but the longer they hesitate to affect a bloodless coup and breathe life into the club im afraid that clubs who were once our competitors will be over the hill and far away.

38. King Jeremy

    Sep 18, 2014, 8:59 #57551

    So I see it has taken just under 24 hours for the AKBs to come out of hiding, with today's excuse being that only Liverpool won their game so, see - it's tough in the Champions Leage. Yes, it is tough, and I don't recall anyone posting that we should have won the game by default. What would have been nice though would have been a starting formation that gave some consideration as to how the oppostion set up.

39. Westlower

    Sep 18, 2014, 8:47 #57550

    Man City beaten, Maureen unable to get his team to hang on to a lead at home, Liverpool scrape through at fortress Anfield against minnows with iffy last minute penalty, Robben still diving - not easy winning ECL games? Arsenal's first defeat since April 6th & yes it was a poor performance, but some perspective needed. Put your toys back in your prams before we play at Villa Park.

40. Pete

    Sep 18, 2014, 8:27 #57549

    Hiccup,You mention all these squad players yet you could say the same about the other top clubs.I didn't see Man City and the glorious chavs pulling up any trees last night.I did see Clichy getting roasted by Robben after being given a ten yard head start and Toure last year playing like a man with three left feet,Wenger new their days were up when he got rid of them yet the other top clubs still roll them out.

41. Hi Berry

    Sep 18, 2014, 6:49 #57548

    GNP whereas I commend you for your position defending Wenger don't you think that his position now is all of his own making? Yes, he has worked miracles over the last ten years but surely his professional pride in his ability to truly compete at the top level, painfully brought home following the increasing number of abject performances over the past couple of seasons, should have told him it's time to go rather than accept another £24m contract? Personally I think that the man's personal pride and his utter belief in his ability to turn things around, despite the mounting evidence that suggests otherwise, means he will do anything in his power to hang on to his position with the Board complicit in this sad state of affairs as long as the cash keeps mounting up.

42. Hiccup

    Sep 18, 2014, 6:19 #57546

    While search parties look high and low for the tooth fairies, GBP stranded on his own, is still spluttering the first thing that comes in to his mouth. "If the Board gave me £100m, I would hand it straight back." Hardly the words from a man constrained financially against his own will. There's two ways of looking at it. Firstly, wenger really did believe in his failed projects that success could be achieved with dross like almunia, Denilson, bendtner etc. if so, that's just gross incompetence. If however, he was lumbered with these players because the Board wouldn't allow him to spend, then with such statements, that makes him a liar and a fraud to the fans. He's just as much part of the spin machine whilst taking the kings dollar for it. Either way, I don't know how he can be defended. But it will all come out in the open one day, will it? Ah yes, when he finally leaves and is a man of such high integrity going to start exposing the club and slinging mud? Or in his next book maybe? That will make him a bigger fraud, but it seems some are quite happy for this to be the case.

43. Mathew

    Sep 18, 2014, 5:23 #57545

    So, 35+ free signings will give backup to Arsenal huh ! How embarrassing can that be, how will that help us in long run ? Last year it was Kim Kallstrom and this year we repeat the same mistakes in defence. A convincing win against a top side with some flurry of goals will give some confidence required to the players and fans. Let's stay optimistic, fans are meant for that.

44. Ozzie

    Sep 18, 2014, 4:07 #57544

    I get the impression that a number of people would give it all away but cant bring themselves to do so, why? Well, as the Priest once remarked "Give me the child until he is seven & I care not who has him thereafter." Such is the influence of being aligned to a footy club. Perhaps these people prefer to suffer rather than face the void that awaits were they to surrender their footy allegiance. At least, that's what it looks like from reading so many comments about the club's repetitious failures and the agonythat it produces. I know only too well what it is like to be hooked, but when it comes to the point where one is no longer enjoying it, what is the point of putting yourself through more? I wonder if it may be preferable to encounterthe void. Who knows, you may meet Badarse there in all his glory :)

45. WENGER MUST GO ASAP.(MARCUS)

    Sep 18, 2014, 1:02 #57543

    Wow,wow what more can I say!!! The score line flattened us. We should have had another usual away spanking ala 6-0. The whole team were absolutely dreadful but some more so than others. Mr messiah 18 years manager of arsenal got exposed big time. The man can just not compete with these younger, hungrier, win at all costs managers I.e Klopp, Mourinho, Simeone, Martinez etc who have him every year for breakfast. It was actually embarrassing to watch. The moment I saw the team sheet I said oh dear, dear. This team has no balance what so ever. We got away with it against man city who fielded a weak team and almost beat us at home. But it was a game to far expecially against a team like Dortmound. A team albeit weakend serevly still battered us into the ground, because they have a tactical beast who gets he's players to play for him with passion and the shirt. It was wonderful to see the mans passion on the touch line applauding even when he's team SHOULD have punished us he was still smiling and full of praise for he's players. Well wev looked like strangers, like we had just been put together that night. It was dreadful. No leaders(how long has that been said for now hmmm akbs?? Any idea), no drive, no passion, no NOTHING and finally no balance. How you going to play a midfield of similar players??? It just does not work. Also for me ramsey and wilshere together does not work for me. They play similar games and both think they our number tens?? Absolutely no balance what so ever. To many technical players. Where's the cdm everyone can see we need?? He plays areta there looool. Who for me is a joke. He looks like he's running in cement. He's absolutely awful that is WHY HE HAS NO CAPs FOR SPAIN loool. Also flamani is another one smh. He is piss poor and if you want any evidence of that go watch the game against man city again. He was at fault for both goals. Yet one messiah believes he did not need to go buy a cdm. You could not make this stuff up. Even souness and merson said this can't keep going on. These spankings. Let me no fool you 2-0 flattered us. We should have got beat at least 5-0 minimum. That's how poor we were. Also all these spankings come from turn overs yes I'm using a rugby phrase lol. Well we have the ball and our trying to mount a attack than boom we lose the aball and the opposition break in numbers and hurt us servely usual from tap ins or clinical finishing smh.souness said excatly what I was thinking at the time. WHERE IN THE HELL IS THE BALANCE?? Where is the veira type player or gilberto silva?? The steel?? Sorry but we our going no where with this clown in charge he is a busted flush. My dream is to wake up to news that wenger has been sacked and klopp is the new manager. What a glorious day that would be for me. The man is just tactically clueless. What in the hell was the game plan??? Sorry it was poor. All round and the manager for me the mr 18 years managing arsenal as he loves to remind us is the main culprit. How in the hell do you allow your squad to be this thread bone?? He knew TV was leaving yet he refused to replace him lool. You can't make this stuff up. Everyone and their blind dog knows that areta and flamani our not good enough at this level maybe at west ham they our. But not this level. The man has to go for me. Tired of this clown. The sooner he's put out to grass the better

46. DW Thomas

    Sep 18, 2014, 0:10 #57542

    Here's the truth. Arsene was once a solid coach who inherited a great defense, then made the team better with his players. Bergkamp was a genius, and Henry a once in a hundred years player. We aren't asking for that necessarily, although we'd love it, just complete the team, gain some tactics, keep our captain, and instill a kick ass spirit, a real spirit, that will bring a real challenge for trophies. He simply is out of ideas and won't change. So he must relinquish the reigns. Last night was embarrassing again. They could have easily scored 4 or 5. A couple observations. Why was Ozil put in front of Bellerin? Second, what has happened to Ramsey? I find myself more and more wanting Arsenal to play like our opponents. That's when you know you are in deep doo doo as a fan. What sticks in the gut is the inability to grow and adapt. Dinosaurs!

47. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 18, 2014, 0:02 #57541

    Hiccup, it looks like it hasn't even took the tooth fairy brigade (some of them anyway) twenty four hours, they must have found 50p under their pillow.

48. Lord Froth

    Sep 17, 2014, 23:55 #57540

    Pete - it's not a one off though is it mate? Every season it's the same. Without banging on about the same things are you saying that you don't think the state of our defence in the run up to the season was not a cause for concern? Or should we not discuss it on an Arsenal website and just go down the Emirates and cheer Wenger on no matter how much he appears hell bent on f***ing up?

49. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 23:29 #57539

    Fozzy's mate, it was a funny one alright, but i'm afraid quip of the day (and there were plenty of contenders)and the fourth place trophy goes to Don't Piss Me 60796, with Hiccup 60804, a close second.

50. Pete

    Sep 17, 2014, 23:25 #57538

    Oh come on you Wob's stop all this bleating,yes we took a beating yet who doesn't in the champions league.Get behind Wenger and the team and show them what true fans are.Too many so called Gooners revel too much in the scandal and drama that comes with defeat and not enough in the victories. Arsene's still a top man and still has enough nous to pull something out of the bag this season.Be men and stand up for the Arsenal not sissy's forever crying, navel gazing and bellyaching.

51. 3 more years of this sh*te

    Sep 17, 2014, 23:01 #57537

    Only 24 hours later and the blame is already being shifted onto the board. The fans grudgingly accepting to 'see him out' will be very happy if, as they believe, that seeing out period lasts for the next 3 years. Bard, sorry mate but looking at Liverpool, he'll bring home the 4th place money again this year and it will be seen by many as a marvelous achievement considering our poor start (the reasons for which will be glossed over), and there are plenty enough fans like GBP around to ensure that performances like last night will be repeated again and again and again until 2017.

52. TJ

    Sep 17, 2014, 22:51 #57536

    @Highbury Boy, to be fair to Coquelin, Frieburg just put him on the left wing which is not at all his position. He's actually a very technical player and someone who has height and physicality too.

53. AMG

    Sep 17, 2014, 22:37 #57535

    I think we need to avoid kicking down on the AKB usual suspects (we all know who they are). They're hurting just as much as everyone else, it's not nice to be let down over and over by someone you have stood up for. They know deep down that Arsene is completely past it, the fact is no longer up for debate. The saddest thing about watching these defeats is seeing the look of embarrassment on the faces of the opposition. Dortmund were actually embarrassed for us last night, they couldn't believe how easy it was - Shades of Germany vs. Brazil. It was the same wit Liverpool and Chelsea last year, they almost felt bad celebrating. The only question remaining is how bad does it need to get before Wenger resigns? How much more evidence does he need of his own incompetence?

54. GBP

    Sep 17, 2014, 22:15 #57534

    Bard - very well said. I think Arsenes biggest hurdle now is how to emerge from being a hybrid money manager/football Coach whos had so much financial constraint imposed upon him for so long into a Coach who once more is a more just a football Coach again. It must be an enormous psychological as well as a practical hurdle. Im not sure its possible. The game has changed markedly while hes been a number crunching quasi Coach whos primary focus has been on debits and credit s rather than defences and attackers. Hes mid 60s and to morph back to a football man again will be even harder than if he was mid 50s. These cretinous low lifes like Mourinho who have revelled in his discomfort and strait jacket wouldnt have lasted a season doing Arsenes job.(Id reverse over that short arsed. little man syndrome riddled gob ****e hawk if i ever ran him over) I ve said for years that Arsene in many ways back in 04 time agreed to compromise his football ambitions to stay and steer the Club through this ground shift transition. Hes took all of the flak that the Board and such like would have taken otherwise and hes been rightly paid well to be the moving target for the fans and press and every media outlet there is, right up from the talk s----e radio prog to the Times and other so called serious sports writing editions. Hes bore that brunt for nigh on a decade and never once squealed 'foul' about his employer and never once branded any player for letting him down and many have!. Many lesser men use the press to castigate their Clubs owners and Boards, blaming them for not having the ambition and not releasing cash etc when in actual fact its mainly because theyre a poor Coach. Not Arsene Wenger. Hes always said consistently that his Club will decide his fate if he doesn't do his job well.In my view Arsene hes done his work well and never flinched from what theyve tasked him to do. Hes turned down many great jobs from Clubs of far higher a prestige than Arsenal and hes done it through loyalty to us, our Club, who he and we all love.One day, the truth of these years will out and some of the people knifing him now will learn stuff and realise that AFC have performed a miracle to be where they are now despite what we ve done off the pitch. They ll realize that AW has been an absolute giant of a bloke to withstand the pressures and i suspect that when the dust settles on his tenure, many will ask just how he did what hes done, top 4 etc etc yr on year. Others will concede that what hes done for the last 10 years in many way surpasses what he did from 96 to 05. I admire the guy as you all know and seeing as he wont be around for much longer, all i would like is us fans to rally round him. Theres isnt much longer. He ll be waving us farewell soon enough and im guessing theyre will be no ' so now you know' smugness from him, just the old wry and wrinkly leathery grin will be there and a wave as he impliedly says thanks to Arsenal for the life style hes been given and he ll be proud to leave us a greater Club than the one he joined. I say support him now while hes bowed and flagging. Even if we are going to get a tonking or three. He deserves it richly. He doesn't deserve mindless snide side swipes. Thats classless and the preserve of the gutter sports press. We re better than them or we damn well should be. We owe no allegiance to the baiting press who are a lot anti Arsenal anyway through their jealousies. Those cretins will love seeing Arsenal fans getting on AWs back. Dont let them. Tell them to f--k off, not Arsene Wenger. Like ive said he s flawed and stubborn but hes our annoying flawed and stubborn old geezer! COYG. Come on Arsene!

55. David

    Sep 17, 2014, 21:00 #57533

    GBP - absolutely agree - it has been very difficult to watch Arsene's demise; over the past 6 years morphing from Alex Ferguson's equal into David Moyes. Probably most of the fans, certainly most of the press and pundits see it, as Arsene and his teams have become a laughing stock. What is evident is that he has not been managed by a truly ambitious board. If he had, he would not have had a renewed contract last year. As for the plans for a smooth succession, I hope you're right. However, the evidence that IG et al can get the man he wants is none too convincing if we take into account the transfer failings of the past couple of years. And with regard to a harmonious transfer, it's just as likely to be a Caesar-like conspiracy and stab in the back. If the board aren't really ambitious, they aren't stupid, and last night was surely a wake-up call for them. As I said, it isn't pleasant to see the transition into a Willy Loman-like figure of tragedy. Very few successful men recognize when they are past it, and AW is no exception. The board is to blame for this.

56. Bard

    Sep 17, 2014, 20:55 #57532

    Hiccup; I don't think he will here for three more years. I have written before that Wenger has had our support because we believed in a vision. Pay off the Stadium and then we will go for it. He has done fantastically well but he is yesterdays man. i don't believe he will be here for 3 more years because he won't produce the money. The board love him because he makes money but when he doesn't he's toast. I have loved what he has given us but he should have quit when he was on top. If yesterdays result said anything it was that the tactical side of the game has passed him by. Until recently he has had a get out of jail card, the debt now he has to produce and he can't. I don't hate him I feel sorry for him. Like a lot of top sports people he has a slightly deluded quality that when it goes well it is called vision and when it doesn't its called delusion. He isn't the first and the won't be the last. I am sure the wheels within the club will be turning. My view is that we are watching the dying embers of Wengers career at Arsenal.

57. GoonerRon

    Sep 17, 2014, 20:39 #57531

    Christ that was painful, utterly ****. Not one player came out if it with a modicum of credit really. The only plus side is its in a competition where we've got time to recover. Interesting debate on here and Wenger and the team have given their detractors plenty of ammo that's for sure. I still feel we have made progress of late - a cup win and most clean sheets in the league last year (acknowledging a few tonkings in there too) to me suggest a level of improvement. Allied with 3 transfers in 12 months over our previous transfer record, we also seem more willing and able to spend bigger on better players. The key thing for me is the balance of team - it's needs reviewing and seriously adjusting. Countless times they got at our CB's as our midfielders were running back facing our goal. The central midfielders and full backs must be disciplined enough to not commit en masse. Back to the training ground....

58. Matty B

    Sep 17, 2014, 20:09 #57530

    Like most I was shocked at the performance. No chance of wining the CL if you play like that away. Dortmund were good, but I suspect most of the opposition know our weaknesses - for christ's I can see them watching on the telly! I know Wenger has really gone off the boil, but did I miss something with Bould? I thought part of his job was to make the team more secure? Did I miss something? Or has he been over ruled by Wenger - in which case why is he there? On current performance I think we will be lucky to be in the top four - the Spuds look good, and Man Utd having blown the bank will push hard. I think only a massive failure will get Wenger the boot and its hard to know what would after last season's thrashings at Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea. Oh god, how depressing!

59. DAN

    Sep 17, 2014, 20:03 #57529

    WENGER FRUSTRATES ME TO THE MAX- HIS INTRASIGENT , MEER SELF BELIEVE AND INACTIONS ARE NON LIKE ANYOTHER. WHY ON EARTH HE IS STILL AT ARSENAL JUST BUFFLES ME- DON’T THOSE ABOVE HIM CARE FOR THE CLUB AND LIKE WINNING? UNTIL THE SUPPORTERS ASK FOR CHANGE BY NOT PATRONISING MATCHES AND MECHANDISES. THIS POOR USELESS MANAGER WILL NEVER LEAVE AS TO HIM IT IS ALWAYS ABOUT THE BIIIG FINANCIAL PROFITS FOR THE CLUB AND HIMSELF AND NOTHING FOR THE TEAMING SUPPORTERS WHO PAY HUGE MONEY DAY IN DAY OUT JUST TO HAVE A FIGHTING CHANCE CLUB. EVERYONE KNOWS WE NEED A VERY GOOD HOLDING MIDFIELDER, A TOP TOP STRIKER, A COUPLE OF GOOD DEFENDERS AND VERY GOOD GOAL KEEPER BUT WHAT DID WE SEE OVER SUMMER? NOTHING. I WILL LIKE TO BE PROFED WRONG BUT IF AT THE END OF THE DAY WE THE SO CALLED LAYPEOPLE SEE WHAT THE MANAGER SHOULD SEE AND YET OUR TEAM IS CRAP THEN THE SO CALLED MANAGER DOES NOT DESERVE TO BE THERE- PERIOD.

60. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 19:53 #57528

    Red Member, I've been saying the same for seasons now it's the only thing that's going to work, if more fans stopped sitting on their hands after every mauling, humiliation, and embarrassment like little sheep with the ah well better luck next time, and it'll come good attitude in support of their messiah over the last five or six seasons and let the club and wenger know what they thought maybe something would have been done, and there would have been less humiliations. But it's still not to late as someone has already alluded to, more fans seem to be waking up at last.

61. Cornish Gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 19:42 #57527

    As Blind Pew said last night at the Old Jamaica Inn " we were lucky to get NIL boys". Nice of the old Frenchie to blame Danny boy weren't it though.

62. SilverGooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 19:21 #57526

    The price we have paid for winning the FA Cup is three more years of Wenger. Most people now realise that he is tactically clueless against the better teams, but why on earth he has left the squad so defensively short is beyond comprehension. Can someone please tell me why on earth we are paying this man £8 million a year?

63. Hghbury Boy

    Sep 17, 2014, 19:18 #57525

    For those few out there who still come on here with lame excuses for Wenger like " it's unfortunate to have so many injuries so early in the season" etc etc and believe that things will change when Theo and Diaby return and are even pushing for Coquelin I would remind them that this Coquelin is the same one who was yanked off after 62 minutes of his debut in the 8-2 Manu defeat and was named by Bild newspaper as 3rd worst player in the Bundesliga when he was on loan last season. Not surprising that he's now back with us. As an ill unfit Chambers was the only defender on the bench it must tell you what even Wenger thinks of Coquelin and obviously Diaby's was considered not fit enough. Will he do the honourable thing if we get smashed yet again at Chelsea? I doubt it.

64. Fozzy's mate

    Sep 17, 2014, 19:02 #57524

    As some have said below I was there long before Wenger, Kroenke and co and will be long after. The yanks have obviously signed a deal re kits with Puma as in each away game before last night we have worn yellow and when we face a team in yellow we where blue. Its all about the dough for DDT, MSS and OGL. Sporting ambition is zilch/zip. Finishing in the top 4 is irrelevant apart from as a further cash cow. As Manure showed by signing players from champions league clubs its all about the cash. Ozil is a disgrace effort wise but is one of many players that have suddenly become left wingers in the last 5 years. As Souness said we have no midfield so why not play 6 left wingers which is obviously the plan when you look at the squad. Prize for the funniest comment was the on re waiting for Diaby to come back which even more funnily OGL used as justification for selling song 2 years ago after waiting 5 years for him to become an adequate holder before telling him to charge forward.

65. Dartford gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 18:55 #57523

    Jamie where are you? after last night maybe Wenger could use an aggressive hard man like you as our dm man. Ozil was total pants, I could not care less if he is being played out of position, does that stop him running or getting stuck in. I wrote at the start of the season that passing on Cesc would come back to haunt us but not this bloody quick. 3 more years of this, thank god I have not got any more hair to lose

66. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 18:55 #57522

    Wengerballs, he's our latest saviour.

67. jjetplane

    Sep 17, 2014, 18:50 #57521

    Just watching that clown Podolski looking for his shin pad and getting half the squad involved. Wenger is making this great club a laughing stock as his so-called WC winners (yeah right) are looking like the new stooges. Feel sorry for Ozil who could (we hope) be a great player for Arsenal but the other two are just playing to the crowd. Too much comfort in this squad and it all radiates with a manager who refuses to get dirty to earn his packet. Disgrace and an insult to those that still struggle to go. I stopped a long time ago though doing 40 years of it was not bad. Notice some very vocal posters on here don't declare whether they go or not. What does that say?! Loxwood on Saturday - big game. You watch what you can afford. Great to hear ya Mr Lynch. Enjoying Hiccup's posts very much. Go Goonerz!

68. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 18:31 #57520

    Post over the page meant for here. OGL has been quick to tell us(yet yet again) the team didn't perform no shyte Sherlock, i wonder does he ever once include or think of himself in those statements.

69. Gerry

    Sep 17, 2014, 17:56 #57519

    Only Arsenal could concede a goal like that last night. 17 years experience in the competition and they produce defending that would make a Sunday league team blush. Away from home, not playing well, seconds to half time, throw in deep into the opposing teams half and its scuffed clear and suddenly its in our net without even a tackle or a midfielder anywhere to be seen, shameful stuff. Its fair to say that any team in the world can have bad nights concerning passing, shooting etc but its the lack of effort, professionalism and respect for the fans and opposition alike that sticks in the throat the most. Ozil has made Arshavin look like a workaholic while the tactic of hoping that the other team will just back off and let us win the game without breaking sweat surely now has to looked at! Just think what a Klopp or Simeone would do with the resources available at Arsenal. I hope some day I will find out!

70. Hiccup

    Sep 17, 2014, 17:19 #57518

    Bard, I think wenger is here for the next 3 years. You say he'll be gone if he doesn't turn it around, but he will. By turn it around I don't mean make great strides and stop the thrashings at half decent teams. But he will get top 4. See it being between us and Liverpool. And we all know how it will be dressed up after this sloppy start as being progress. The tooth fairy brigade are having a 24 hour siesta but will be back tomorrow defending wenger and it will become the fans fault for not getting behind him. It's been the case after every other thrashing and will continue to be. By tonight we'll be back to Dylan lyrics and the odds at which minute of the game wenger will strangle the 4th official on Saturday.

71. Bard

    Sep 17, 2014, 16:28 #57517

    Its a strange state of affairs on the site today as nearly everyone agrees. I wonder if its the same in the Gooner Kingdom. Even arseblog was scathing. If it is it will pretty tense at the next home game. I wonder if there are rumblings at board level? Is the gravy train about to grind to a halt. Sometimes one game and one result becomes the catalyst for change. As Pete said BD weren't that special but they steamed in to us and we crumbled like a pack of cards. Other sides will have noted that. Given how abject the performance I don't see how Wenger can turn it around. He's stuck with the same players till Jan at least, he has very little room for manoeuvre.

72. GBP

    Sep 17, 2014, 16:14 #57516

    CT and 'what was the point' .... To be honest guys im well aware of Wengers failings and a lot of what you lad say isnt so wrong. In fact, much of it is right. Ive backed him for years. Always defended him against the moronic press when he was hounded years back, always thought other Coaches were unfair and rude to him and generally think hes done a great job though hes faded in the last 3/4 years of course he has. All Coaches do.Even Busby and Shankly and Paisley and Clough et al did.I just dont turn on people who i once backed and liked. Its faicke and hypocritical. Yes hes flawed and stubborn and faded but hes OUR flawed faded and stubborn Coach and his days at the helm are numbered. I believe the Board and AW know it too.I even think his departure date is known and maybe, his successor is known too. Its for these reasons ill see him out as ive stuck with him ie with my regards and blessing. Hes been a great Coach and hes done a hell of a lot for Arsenal. I dont like the foul abuse i read on here about him. Im fine with his critics as i say and share some of the points but the dogs abuse? Its not right and its not needed. Change at Arsenal will and is happening i think. We ve just got to hang in there and just back the lads on the pitch. Im not saying you guys don't back the players either. The Board arent daft. If AW does try and hang in beyond his welcome they will shift him. I hope it doesn't come to that. Wenger and his charges have given us all some good times down the years. Thats me guys. Sorry to disappoint.

73. Man United Killer

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:58 #57515

    Ozil and Sanchez in conversation after Dortmund game.Ozil: why do you work so hard Sanchez?Alexis: it's Alexis not Sanchez. Get it right slouch!Ozil smiles. Not bothered at being called a slouch and does his gum trick.Ozil: Relax man...alright Sanchez...sorry I mean Alexis.Are you going to tell me why you break your back like that in games?Sanchez: How about you tell me why you play passenger game in game out.Sanchez grooms his hair looking in the mirror whiles Ozil speaks.Ozil: you haven't been around here long enough have you? It's pointless.We are just pretenders not contenders. Besides what does it matter.I'll start every game regardless.and above all I have worked with managers who have a plan and this one here has no clue. So why bother.Sanchez: you just confirmed my fears.what the hell have I gotten myself into. I guess it's goodbye to trophies then? Ozil: trophies? What are you smoking? I guess this is where I say welcome to Arsenal.Sanchez: Who is the best barber in town?

74. Tony Evans

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:54 #57514

    GBP - I admire your optimism even though it is misplaced as far as Wenger is concerned.

75. Don't Piss On Me & Say It's Raining

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:53 #57513

    And further. When I'm at Arsenal I support the team 100% and am probably one of the few people these days who still leaves the game with a sore throat. So a the pro Wengerites who regularly state the usual 'try supporting your team' or 'sod off to Spurs'. Go do one!

76. GBP

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:41 #57512

    Hi Tony - Fair points and lots of merit. Even those of us who dont jump on the bandwagon to beahead him over on Tower Hill deep down know and accept that his magic hat blew away in the wind quite a while back. You and Bard usually make great points i have to say.

77. What was the point in leaving Highbury?

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:37 #57511

    GBP - I'm honestly not having a go mate because on forums like this everyone should be allowed their opinion and whatever camp you are in doesnt mean you love Arsenal any more or less. However, I am just interested in how you can still back Wenger because i just cant see it. All of the problems we have today have been the same problems for years now. I dont think people are talking with the benefit of hindsite. Thats why so many people, myself included, have gone past angry. We are so boarded with groundhog day and saying "i told you so". Its like car crash in slow motion. You can see the problems in June that need addressing. Everyone can. Tactically he is hopeless. He cant motivate. Seems obsessed with playing players out of positon. He just seems hell bent on going against what the world and his wife are telling him to prove a point. He operates on a huge buget, one of the biggest in world football. What is his defense please and please dont say he brought in Vieira, Anelka and the likes or he has no money. These arguments are long gone.

78. Don't Piss Me & Say It's Raining

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:37 #57510

    As an anti Wenger season ticket holder who will damn weIl continue to attend my beloved Arsenal and refuses to budge because of the accountant in charge I would find the comments of GBP, Westlower etc hilarious if it wasn't so sad. The whole money issue that has been the fallback of such Arsene excuse mongers no longer stands and so the posts get more and more ludicrous after every game. No quoting of stats after this game eh! Pathetic!I've been saying it for years. It's not about the money in many respects but so much is about creating a team that plays to their strengths, use of good tactics and good use of a clubs resources.Wenger fails on all counts. The pro Wengerites will point at the Chelski's and the boys from MiddleEastlands but look at the teams with success in recent years Swansea! Wigan! Dortmund! Athletico! All these clubs have excelled in hose 3 criteria and you can even look towards Everton now with Martinez doing the same. Imagine Martinez or Klopp with our resources!!In Wenger we rust and yet the sheep bleat away believing it's rain when in fact it's piss!

79. Tony Evans

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:28 #57509

    Lord Froth - Agree with your comments. I've long since lapsed in to a couldn't care less mode too, and a win, loss or draw means much the same to me now - which says it all as to how low Wenger has brought so many of us. What amazes me is that there are still blinkered Gooners out there that defend him! Like you I am torn about CL qualification this season, my heart says yes but my head says don't be daft - accept anything to get Wenger out.

80. CT Gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 15:15 #57508

    Thank you bad arse, reading your main post it finally feels like we watched the same game, not sure about GBP though, can't bring himself to say anything negative about Wenger. I just don't understand how a company can allow their leadership to leave them so exposed to Risk. If you view AFC as a company, the business goal is to finish 4th and get to the knock out stage of the CL. I think quietly the board are seriously concerned about the managers ability to meet those goals this year, hence buying DW behind Wengers back. Not enough though...

81. Edmund

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:43 #57507

    GBP if you are Arsene Wenger in disguise, are you still sure you want to build your team around Ozil instead of Fabregas? Thanks for ignoring the majority of fans.

82. Tony Evans

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:43 #57506

    GBP It's not just last night's performance in isolation that is so depressing, and has most of us reaching for the valium; it's last night on top of the countless other gutless, insipid, tactically and defensively bereft performances we have witnessed under Wenger, with no sign of any lessons being learned. You say the CL is recoverable - yes but only to scrape out of the group before a hammering by a true heavyweight as per usual. Wenger needs wins you say? He needs a kick up the arse more like!

83. Lord Froth

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:39 #57505

    I used to be on the edge of my seat during big Champions League matches but gradually over the years the seemingly endless ability of the team to fail to, or really want to compete now leaves me slumped and watching dispassionately. Even my wife is surprised that I don't make a comment anymore after the inevitable loss. I have learnt, as have many of you, to not really care anymore. It fails to be sport when one side, from the manager to some of the players seem not to really care if they win, if even only for their own ego or pride. Wenger postures like he is upset but it's like me proclaiming that I want to win the Euromillions but not wanting to spend the money on the ticket. I'm torn between wanting us to fail in the league in order to not be in the Champions League and possibly prompt a change in the heirarchy but on the otherhand afraid of what that means with the clubs lack of ambition it's likely that we would be in the outback for many years. It's a shame as I used to love competitive football matches when they existed at Highbury.

84. jeff wright

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:36 #57504

    Wenger will get 2nd at best in the group now and deja vu last season will then have to play a top side in the KO tie - and we all know what that means. In reality with the 4th place looking less than certain now than it was last season Wenger will be better off concentrating on the league and forgetting his pipe dreams regarding the European Cup. He won't win the cup but failure to get 4th place in the league will see him getting his coat on and calling for a cab . Some of us would willingly call it for him and pay the fare .TAXI !*!!

85. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:35 #57503

    N4, there'll be positives taken out of it you can be sure of that, after all it was only a blip.

86. GBP

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:34 #57502

    Pete - a performance like that last night is like manna from heaven for the aspirin and valium brigade who are all out in force with their uniforms on, rifles co*cked and boots polished but it was an insipid show to say the least. Moreover those of us who back Wenger have to accept that as things stand, its looks an iffy moment for him right now.He needs wins starting at Villa, Thankfully, the CL is recoverable with a full team to pick from. Badarse has summed it up about right.

87. GBP

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:05 #57501

    Pete - a performance like that last night is like manna from heaven for the aspirin and valium brigade who are all out in force with their uniforms on, rifles co*cked and boots polished but it was insipid to say the least. Moreover those of us who back Wenger have to accept that as things stand, its looks an iffy moment for him right now.He needs wins starting at Villa, Thankfully, the CL is recoverable with a full team to pick from. Badarse has summed it up about right.

88. KC

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:01 #57500

    I am sick of watching an ill disciplined team and why I agree a more astute boss could get them better organised the fact is that Wenger does not seem capable of recognising both Arteta and Flamini are no where near the level required for the position and job they should oversee. Its so obvious that you have to wonder has he lost all touch with reality. Add that to a lack of defensive depth and a game plan that does not address another teams strengths and we end up with an easy to score against team as away performances prove. But I go because I am an Arsenal supporter, wish I could just turn off but I can not, I just hope things change while knowing they wont and getting more angry and start to despise a manager I once thought was the magic man - How time changes!!.

89. 600NER PETE

    Sep 17, 2014, 14:01 #57499

    I gave up hope of actually enjoying watching Arsenal play several years ago but as a die hard fan still endure watching most matches online or on tv. (I stopped paying money to attend matches or buy merchandise as a protest at the way the club is run). I thought things couldn't get any worse until the Cesc fiasco. We were the first in line for once to purchase one of the best midfielders in the world. We should have taken this opportunity and built our team around him. There were some people on this site were saying at the time that Cesc was overated and not needed. This was about a player who for years almost single handedly kept us 3rd or 4th when we had the likes of Eboue, Scillaci, Denilson, Djourou, Diaby, Silvestre, Song, Vela and Bendtner in our squad. To see him playing for Chelsea is a sickener and surprise surprise, he is one of their best ever signings! Moving to the new stadium was supposed to help us compete in the transfer market. We needed a striker. Costa becomes available but we end up with Welbeck. Mind you, if we had ended up with Cesc or Costa Wenger would have probably played them on the wing!!!

90. Mark T

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:24 #57495

    I go to every home and away game (apart from European games) and have done for many years. I'm close to throwing in the towel. Last night could have happened in any one of the last seven or eight seasons. Our manager seems to take pride in not needing to have tactics. The problem is every manager who does believe in tactics usually beats us. Part of the problem is we don't learn. The same errors keep being made - most games. You can just write the script. We've been second best in every game this season, possibly with the exception of Palace (though even that is debatable). We have a manager who seems oblivious to the fact that we have numerous serious injuries EVERY season. And he refuses to reinforce because the squad is supposedly good enough. Yeah, Sanogo is a genius. And playing a kid at right back against one of the best side in Europe - pure genius. If anyone now thinks it's going to change they must be nuts. See you at Villa for more of the same.

91. Bard

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:21 #57494

    Ozzie; I get your point but I can't ever bring myself to hope that we get trounced. I always want us to win regardless of the situation. Also there is no guarantee that a few thrashings would mean Wenger getting the sack. The best case scenario is that he resigns probably at the end of the season. But on £8m a year would you. I could take dogs abuse all day long for that kind of money. He should have walked away at the end of last season with his head held high. I don't see a happy ending to this chapter in our history.

92. kilkenny cat

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:15 #57493

    Really is hard to say anything original or different. Like angry and frustrated said these posts could be any time in the last 7 years. Last night has happened before and will happen again. Cant blame indiviuals,its the collective collapse,which always happens. Lack of leaders,lack of heart,lack of respect for the fans,who knows. Ultimately one man is to blame. He picks the team. He buys and sells. He is the one with no tactics,no plan b no fresh ideas. Im afraid we have to accept it. He will be going nowhere for at least 3 years and probably longer.

93. Deja Vu

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:11 #57492

    Groundhog Day. Simple as that.

94. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:08 #57491

    We were let off lightly alright Kev, the get out of jail cards had to run out some time especially when we come up against a good team. OGL was all smiles before the game with hugs all round but all that soon disappeared when Doetmund and Klopp got to work, completely outplayed and out classed and run ragged while a past it of a manager sat there cluless, embarrassing, there weren't any hugs at the end barely a handshake and away skulking down the tunnel, rumour had it that he refused or was refusing to give interviews afterwards but he obviously relented as Sky had one (maybe it was only French TV)and there was no smirking and sly grinning in that. Is there any hierarchy at this club who can put the long suffering fans out of their misery? and for those who always ask who do you replace their messiah with (even when a list was provided on here on numerous occasions over the last four or five years) look no further than the opposite dug out last night where a manager who knew what he was doing was standing.

95. Pete

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:08 #57490

    I would say our worst performance in Europe I can remember for some time,players seemed like they were out on a jog.Sad thing is Dortmund are nothing special just showed a lot more commitment and seemed to be urged on by their retarded support.They reminded me of the old manure, a team of runners closing down everything and diving all over the place.Wenger needs to get his finger out and get the team up for Saturday and I'm sure he will.First defeat in Germany for ages so I'm not going to go over the top like the DM's who at this moment in time will be knee jerking over everything caught up in a kind of moonie third heaven.

96. Westlower

    Sep 17, 2014, 13:01 #57489

    The OX played well, the rest didn't. Never seen an Arsenal side pass so badly. Sanchez for all his endeavour, repeatedly gave the ball back. We're desperate to get Diaby back into midfield to add some height & physical power. Arteta, Ramsey & Wilshere provide next to no cover for the defence. Coquelin would be worth trying in the absence of Flamini. It was unfortunate to be missing Debuchy, Chambers, Monreal & Flamini, forcing the debut of Bellerin. Even with our worst display of the season we could and should have scored goals. Who knows how that would have affected BD's approach if DW had taken his chances. Giroud get's more valuable by the game, with his goals & his heading ability defending corners. The team will assume a better shape with the return of Theo. It's unreal that we have upwards of 6 players unavailable so early in the season. With Galatasary & Anderlecht drawing it wasn't a terminal defeat & we are still 2/7 to progress from the group.

97. TJ

    Sep 17, 2014, 12:46 #57488

    Same old, same old. Honestly, the last three out of four seasons we've had to dash at the last minute of the transfer window because Wenger can't see the holes in the squad so the board step in to bail him out. Robbie Savage said in his last column on tactics that we need a DM. Wouldn't you guys prefer Coquelin to Arteta and Flamini? He could hardly be worse than those two. That's the thing though, Wenger doesn't study the opposition, as Henry said in his biography 'for Wenger to do that would be the ultimate admission of defeat'. I watched a programme on Jose Mourinho and his players said they know everything about the opposition, 'even shoe size'. But Wenger can't even get our own team right. We just open up to every big team we play and they know exactly what we'll do. That's with Ozil floundering on the wing and no protection for the defence. In truth I don't care about the CL matches- it's 6-8 matches generally that the first team have to fit in, standing no chance of winning, when we could just focus on the domestic cups. But Wenger just wants to have a crack at the Champions League playing charge of the light brigade football and secure fourth place to have a crack the year after. Ad infinitum...

98. Ozzie

    Sep 17, 2014, 12:38 #57487

    Bard, what difference does it make if Arsenal DO win at Villa or even Chelsea for that matter - would that not be delaying the inevitable? Short of wishing ill will on someone I would rather see Arsenal take a few more beltings which may well hammer home the point in some damn thick skulls. The odd win here and there is now meaningless and I go back on what I said previously about enjoying each game on it's merits. I have so far enjoyed watching only one game in five this season and that is not due so much to the result but as to how the team is performing. I have known sports teams purposely put in bad performances in the hope of ridding themselves of the manager/coach and I certainly wish this was now the case but as mum used to say: Wish in one hand....

99. What was the point in leaving Highbury?

    Sep 17, 2014, 12:37 #57486

    Is anyone seriously suprised? There have been endless games like this over the years. No one at the club cares. The manager is safe, the owner is safe and so are most of the players. Why? Because our support have let this rot continue for so long now. How can anyone seriously defend Wenger any more? He is now spending money and we are still turning in shambolic performances devoid of idea, passion, tactical awareness, effort and this famous mental spirit. We know we're not going to win this so so what! Its groundhog. Its boring. Its embarrasing. And its going to continue as long as Wenger is in charge as so many of us have predicted.

100. Tony Evans

     Sep 17, 2014, 12:36 #57485

     I have been thinking back to the cup final win over Hull. On the day, although I had a feeling that defeat would spell the end for Wenger, I could not bring myself to want Arsenal to lose. After watching last night's horror show I damn well wish we had lost to Hull and maybe now that out of date charlatan, Wenger, would be blighting some other team. A and F - great comment. I could not have put it better myself.

101. Yawn

     Sep 17, 2014, 12:28 #57484

     Groundhog Day returns! It's so hilarious you have to laugh. just look at the ridiculous situation a club of Arsenal's resources are in: over £150 mil in the bank, going into a CL game with a rookie with no clue, completely short of defenders and an injury "crisis" (that isn't a crisis since it happens every f**** year!). A keeper who is under no pressure to lose his place as his 'challenger' is an OAP from Nice. Goes out and a club of Arsenal's wealth is signing ManYoo's 5th choice cast-off "striker", who has had 3 clear chances in 2 games, and not hit the target ONCE! It must be a tough day to be an AKB. NO EXCUSES. Klopp is paid less than half of Wenger's salary - look it up! Dortmund's wage bill is 40% lower than Arsenal's! Dortmund were missing Hummels and Reus - one is a world cup winner and one of the best defenders in Europe. The other is one of the most coveted players in world football. Not to mention Gundogan, one of the best attacking midfielders in Europe. Who were Arsenal missing? Errrrm...oh yes Theo Walcott! LOL. Or is it Giroud and his amazing goals record in big matches? Give Klopp this Arsenal team and you'd see superior commitment, work rate and results. Wenger quite simply put, is a shambolic joke of a manager, dining off success of over a decade ago. The mere fact his defenders keep mentioning how he transformed Henry (in 1999!) is proof of this. He has done to Ozil what he did to Arshavin and sapped all confidence out of a superb player. Pathetic. The defending is a joke, 10 years and counting. He hasn't finished inside the top 2 of the league in a decade - Rodgers managed it at his first attempt. All that money in the bank and he is naming Arteta club captain and playing a turd like Flamini, Captain Stupid. All of Arsenal's performances this season have been abysmal bar 45 mins against Citeh. So where is the excuse Wenger-lovers? It cannot be money, since Arsenal have had far richer teams than Everton, Dortmund, Leicester etc. No it is plain and simple: the manager is a fraud and any ambitious board with a care about football woulda waved him off last summer after the FA Cup. But oh no. Arsene just had to have a new juicy contract, could not turn down all that nice lucre could he! Ooooh I forgot: he does "for love". Nowt to do with money. Cos Arsene is against all that horrible money in football (which is why he negotiated a payrise for himself!)

102. Garry

     Sep 17, 2014, 12:23 #57483

     The best tackle of the match came from AOC, back-tracking and making a last ditch challenge in the 6 yard box. When he came on he seemed up for the fight and was getting up and down the pitch. We just don't have a real box to box player - Ramsey and Wiltshere are not these sort of players and we are left exposed unable to break up play/attacks through the middle, not even cynical fouls like Ciy performed on Saturday. Song on loan would've been a decent option, but I suspect Diaby will be back soon for a couple of games..... But I am looking forward to Walcott, Sanchez and Wellbeck upfront, forget defending and just attack, attack, attack!

103. jeff wright

     Sep 17, 2014, 12:18 #57482

     Badarse, why not try telling it like is for a change ? Ozil was not a bold gamble he was a late panic buy after the defeat by Villa at home . Panic buys often turn out to be money wasted. There was a chance that summer to make a bold buy and that was Suarez but money got in the way with financial prudence replacing ambition when the 42m and one pound failed bid was rejected by Liverpool. Suarez must have felt overwhelmed to learn that Wenger didn't rate him as being worth 50m ! If Wenger and the now invisible Ivan the Uncredible thought that this would have Suarez jumping up and down like a demented chimp on a trampoline DEMANDING that Liverpool let him join us then they are more stupid than I thought they were. Tbh, I don't think that our players really rate Wenger now days and some probably mock him behind his back and perhaps those like Ozil and Sanchez were not fully aware of his shortcomings when agreeing to join us. It is noticeable that players like Arshavin and others have soon deteriorated after a few months under Arsene's coaching , young ones like AOC do not improve under Wenger's regime from what they were when joing him from their original clubs and soon become worse after starting well. Also players that have now gone such as Tony Adams have made comments disparaging Wenger's lack of tactical nous. Others such as Sagna about the lack of real ambition to try and compete for trophies other than the 4th place one. A belated fortutitous FAC win obviously did not change that view for Sagna . The French TV station that employed Wenger to comment on les bleus World Cup games were inundated with complaints from irate viewers about Wenger's obvious lack of any input on the tactical aspects regarding the games he commented on . This viewers were not brainwashed AKB's and demanded that he should be replaced with someone who had a better idea of football tactics . Wenger was fired by the TV company after the World Cup. The good news is though that we have him managing our club for the next three years.If he can manage to stay that long of course ; the omens however for him on that occurring are not looking good.

104. Ozzie

     Sep 17, 2014, 12:06 #57481

     Does anyone remember a club called Arsenal? They used to play at Highbury and oh boy, could they play. RIP

105. N4

     Sep 17, 2014, 12:06 #57480

     BADARSE, I think it's one of the fairest comments I've read from you and still showing positiveness! Although, I don't agree with your last assessment about January or end of season as this is repeated every season! However, in reading your comments I feel that you still support Wenger's mistake and are scared to say anything negative or any critics about him! I'm sure you know that it's ok from time to time to be against the Manager or Wenger in this case!

106. Seven Kings Gooner

     Sep 17, 2014, 11:55 #57479

     Spot on again Kev - I don't get too upset with C/L football because we always leave when it gets serious anyway. Kev : Never mind October 5th, the game against Villa this week is going to be very physical. Roy Keane has got Villa fired up and whoever plays wide left, I wish him luck against Mr Hutton, apparently he is back to his really nasty best!

107. Graham Simons

     Sep 17, 2014, 11:50 #57478

     I was going to try to get a ticket for the City game but come on - £70 for a lower tier ticket and £100 for upper tier is just taking the mick.Can we not just charge £50 for whichever match is being played? no real difference between upper and lower tier - I just resent pay upwards of £50 to watch my team.

108. Bard

     Sep 17, 2014, 11:31 #57477

     I get the argument about not pitching up for games but I can't do that. its in my blood. I would rather go and endure the pain. I also don't think there will be a sacking. Wenger will decide when he goes. I do agree with you Baddie, he desperately needs a result against the Villa to steady things down. A bad loss there and trouncing by Chelsea may well be the turning point. What is staggering is the team looks so unbalanced and too many players playing in the wrong places. Ozil can't play on the wing and Arteta who I like isn't a holding player in a million years.

109. Torbay gooner

     Sep 17, 2014, 11:01 #57475

     A truly abysmal performance continuing our long line of similar away day displays against teams that press the ball and get in our faces, helped by the fact that they have a battle plan. Our weaknesses are for all to see and have been commented on by most of the previous posters. Ultimately our biggest weakness is our broken record, tactically devoid manager. Do we really have to endure 3 more years of this?

110. BADARSE

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:54 #57474

     Well there you go, obliteration! I was very impressed with BD's start and expected them to slow and for us to get a foot in the game. After around 15 minutes I texted a pal saying I thought BFG was outstanding, a moment later he made a poor pass, that epitomised the game for me. They didn't tire! The distance stats spoke volumes, more than a kilometre did each BD player run. We lacked inspiration throughout and with those few opportunities we fluffed our lines. Very disappointing. Arteta was unfit and is slowing dramatically, coupled with the BFG's lack of pace we are vulnerable right down the middle. Bellerin was raw as half expected he would be, and yes our insistence on pushing the wing backs forward left us terribly exposed throughout the evening. I did think that for twenty minutes or more that we were weathering the early storm, but the storm continued and became a tempest. We needed some form of relief and it never came. Individually poor performances? No real strategy, or game plan? Either way a goal can change much of that and sadly one never came. Tear up the script time? Not really. When it seems you are adrift in shark-infested waters you cannot jump ship, but from here things are not looking so good. Mesut still fails to enforce his presence, though I think he needs those around to shield him to allow him to benefit, and that change of position screams out now. He certainly isn't doing it so far, a failed gamble in buying him? Possibly. Right now we need to regroup and prepare for Villa Park, a good performance there and the ship is steadied, a poor one and I think some will be manning the lifeboats. Hopefully if the problems continue they may be rectified in January, or at the end of the season. We shall see.

111. Fozzy

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:49 #57473

     Last night's performance wasn't just woeful, it was worse than that. Staying away from games? Interesting thought, but I will still be in the online queue on Friday morning for an Anderlect ticket. I haven't seen Anderlect play since a memorable night in April 1970....

112. dazzy90

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:48 #57472

     You simply would not see a Mourinho side play as bad, as clueless, as gutless, as that totally inept 'performance' as Arsenal's last night.Therein lies the difference.Winners. Losers. We have learnt nothing in the last 5, 6, 7, 8 years under this gormless tw@t. No leadership on or off the pitch at EVERY level within Arsenal F.C.Wenger - you are an embarrassem*nt to the club now. Just GO!

113. Hi Berry

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:47 #57471

     King Jeremy above nailed it completely - away from home in Europe and the full backs and midfield bombing forward suicidally - at times we were defending fast penetrating counter-attacks with only two or three players. Comical and predictable.

114. Highbury Boy

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:34 #57470

     You have to hand it to Arsene. He's on a new £8m pa 3 year contract despite many woeful performances like that in recent years. He alone determines not to buy a midfield holding player,not to replace Vermaelen or the other departing cbs, not to take up the option on Cesc, and to adopt the same tactics for every game regardless of the opposition. Even at the press conference before the game when he was asked about injuries. He first mentioned Walcott. Then when it was made clear it was about defensive problems he said he had Monreal who could play at the back. Only later did he say that Monreal didn't even travel. As far as I could tell he wasn't picked up on that. He has a persuasive way with the media and with many Arsenal fans who were singing "One Arsene Wenger" after the Cup Final win. No doubt the Arsene apologists will point out that Welbeck could have scored a hat trick to give us a 3-2 win or we were unlucky with injuries or it's the fans' fault for not getting behind Ozil. Perhaps someone will come on and say Calum Chambers' dad says he's stopped coughing and he'll be ok for the Villa game.

115. GBP

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:15 #57469

     An inept uninspired performance, no doubt about that. The positive is that its the worst game of the group out of the way early. We normally perform so well in Germany so maybe a beating was due. As you say, time to recover. Lets start at Villa! COYG

116. David

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:11 #57468

     Nothing more to add to what has been said by posters and the article. All spot on. So where is the positive spin and condescending words of the AW worshippers? Come on, you know who you are.

117. allybear

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:08 #57467

     Very good articles and as stated it has been the same for many years. The OGL followers are very quiet but will no doubt be on defending him&saying that its very early in the season. Im sure that Villa cant wait to get at them. Wheather we like it or not we have 3 more years of this dross.

118. Bard

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:02 #57466

     I don't have a problem with cash in the bank really Kev and I don't think the answer lies in buying a shedload of players. As you identify on paper we are a good (ish ) side certainly good enough to trouble BD but Wenger seems unable to motivate them or organise them effectively enough. We have seen variations on last night too many times for it to be a fluke. You have to ask the question of whether the players have lost their faith in Wenger. There is a little point in criticising individuals it was men against boys. Giving Wenger more money to spend is throwing good money after bad. I also wrote earlier today, I don't think he will last this season if he doesn't turn it around. At the very least we need guts and application.

119. Red Member

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:01 #57465

     Johnny Lynch has stated the obvious and he is correct - STOP GOING!!!! Season ticket holders have always been Wenger's biggest supporters. It is a pity so many of them don't realise this. Question: is blind loyalty actually the best way of supporting your team? I think that maybe if there had been more protests in recent years we wouldnt still be in this groundhog day situation

120. N4

     Sep 17, 2014, 10:01 #57464

     Well said Martyn! About the colour of our shirts it's so true as when I tuned in I thought we are really dominating when soon after I realised that it was the other team...duuhh!!!

121. DJ

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:51 #57463

     The trouble is everyone bar Wenger could see this coming! You think that as you don't work in football you must be missing something and can't see the bigger picture but it has been four years since the 8-2 at Old Trafford at nothing has changed. Away from home against the top sides we are so open it's untrue! If, as it seems Wenger is unwilling to scarifice his principle the board must act now and remove him from his position. This is not a knee jerk reaction it has been four years in the making! Ps Cesc or Ozil you decide!

122. Wengerballs

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:46 #57462

     Mikel Arteta...ageing, diminutive, slow, toffees journeyman Mike Arteta. What a frekin joke. Phrench footballing artiste and effete, Wanger, failed yet again to buy a true defensive midfielder. And who the f*ck is Hector Bellerina?

123. John Abrehart

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:41 #57461

     I think that it is a slur on the club, it's supporters and traditions. How could the Arsenal management let it happen? Yes, say that it is all part of the huge commercial exercise that involved with a modern mainstream football club but there are limits. I refer of course to the dull Oxford/Cambridge blue 'strip' adorning the players last night. There was no colour clash and our proud red and white should have been worn. If the 'globalisation' of AFC is the aim, then proudly display our historic club colours, the fans were a sea of red and white and not some insipid blue that has no place in the history of our club. The game? Oh yes. well….same old problems in defence, same old problems in midfield, same old problems up front. Welbeck had 3 chances and one cannot help thinking that TH14 would have buried two. We seem to have got three £12 centre forwards. Why not buy one worth £36 who knows where the net is?

124. Martyn

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:40 #57460

     Having implored Wenger to splash the cash on players like Ozil and Alexis us fans are realising that he is unable to build a team with them in it. I'm convinced that Wenger would have preferred not to spend on either because he believes in developing young talent, then selling it. I firmly believe that a more astute, tactically aware manager would get the very best from this squad we have. All we see at present is a team bereft of knowing what to do, lacking leadership on and off the pitch. What must Ozil and Alexis be thinking coming into this set up? There are no easy answers but a manager like Klopp would breathe a future into this club and raise the expectations us fans deserve.

125. Peter Wain

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:32 #57459

     Why do we have to wear a scummy blue kit we play in red and white. No wander we played like the scum.

126. King Jeremy

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:28 #57458

     Lets be honest, this could have been any European away game in any of the last 7-8 years. We always, always play the same way and we either get lucky and snatch a draw or (as in Dortmund last year) do the occasional smach-and-grab. More often than not though they end up like last night. The first 20 minutes they were like rabbits in the headlights and as is pointed out in the report, a more clinical team (i.e. Chelsea) would have properly embarrased us. What is continually embarrasing is the manager's lack of tactical preparation and his continued belief that our style of play will win out. It never has against opposition of this calibre and necer will. last night called for 2 banks of 4 inviting Dortmund to try and get through. Instead, against a team that is renowned for fast direct attacking, we find ourselves with 7 players in their half. In that situation it only takes one mis-control (and there were plenty of those last night) and Dortmund have space to attack that they only dream of. I lost count of how many times Gibbs was caught upfield. People will say "if only we bought a proper defensive midfielder". What use would said player have been last night if the team, collectively, cannot defend. 5th October will be very painful viewing. That said, there are the small matters of a trip to an in-form Villa and the NLD before then. Things could get very ugly very soon. Still, only 3 more years to wait......

127. Johnny Lynch

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:21 #57457

     The answer is simple, always has been. Stop going . Empty Stadiums = Sacked manager. And I use the term Manager in its vaguest terms

128. N4

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:20 #57456

     Firstly, Kev I feel your comments and it is very accurate. Angry & F... nailed it and I 100% that we have been discussing the same things since 5 or more years ago and nothing has changed! The difference between us and small teams are that they don't lose like we do! Those who still see any positive from the game to the manager to the board are simply spuds fans in disguise! It was simply another embarrassing game to watch...to me and it has been a few season ago that AW needs to go...sorry let me correct that needs to f**k off!!!...and the board as well!!! What a disgrace!

129. ALAN WHIFFIN

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:17 #57455

     PLEASE GO WENGER

130. unchives

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:14 #57454

     What is beyond me is how fickle the squad has become over several years now, they can produce some excellent football as a team, as they did against Man City, but also collapse together as happened last night, for the first time ever I switched off before the end of the game....like the players I did not care....what a waste of energy, im getting too old for this.

131. Derby Gooner

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:13 #57453

     Likewise, not commented here for a while. As I was watching all I could think was that this was Alan Pardew-esque in the crushing incompetency of the performance. Even the body language and mannerisms of OGL appeared to mirror the that great champion from the North East. I felt a great calm wash over me as it became obvious we were going to be on the wrong end of a thumping...right up there with the 8-2, 6-0 etc, etc, but somehow it didn't happen. Every team can lose, but that was a performance utterly devoid of merit. How many games played so far this season? they looked mentally and physically shot...Never mind Chavski on the 5th October, what about Villa away this weekend....

132. fozzy's mate

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:07 #57452

     Kev as you know I am possibly the only person in the world who has whinged mored about the unused cash reserves than yourself. When faced with arguments that this would change as time went on my answer was why when we didn't use the resources at our disposal then. Repeating what's been said its been obvious that the aim of the DDT and MSS now aka Ivan the invisible is to finish in the FPT position and last 16 of ECL with the minimum required investment. OGL is of course not blameless in taking his ridiculous gambles of stacking the squad full on one type of player whilst ignoring the shorttcomings and leaving us threadbare in various positions but the major factor is the overall lack of sporting ambition. Last night was but a repeat of many away games of the last few years in TTT (turgid tikka takka) ripped apart by an aggressive fast breaking side. I hoped that after last seasons various maulings and those endured by Bayern and Barcelona in the champs league and Spain in the world cup employing TTT that OGL would realise these tactics do not work. However at Everton, Leicester and Dortmund TTT has been rendered outdated. At the back Kos and BFG are struggling cruelly exposed by onrushing midfields and receiving no shield from what Souness correctly described as a non existent midfield. Our fight it with Manure, Liverpool and Spurs for the FPT. Sadly no matter how big our cash reserves are with the current board this will not change.

133. Miles F

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:05 #57451

     I think I said in an article 5 years ago that we would not win another trophy under AW. Well, to my astonishment, we did, but only because we played all our matches at home or at Wembley, and only because all the other decent teams were knocked out at the quarter final stage, and despite thoroughly inept performances in the semi final and final and a considerable slice of luck in both. But nothing has changed in substance, has it? We can bring in a motley collection of talented individuals, but we do not build a team or play as a team or even understand how to play as a team or how to go about beating other teams. I thought our first 30 minutes against City was very encouraging, but since then we have reverted to type. I was as delighted as anyone else to have been proved wrong last May, but anyone who thinks that that lucky win is going to change things for us is sadly mistaken. Angry and Frustrated is right: all it has done is guaranteed us another 3 years of the same, though this year I fear that we will be even luckier than usual if we scrape 4th place.

134. chris dee

     Sep 17, 2014, 9:05 #57450

     Same old Arsenal same old problems.Lack of defensive organisation,lack of intensity,lack of physicality.An arrogance or just stupidity that sets out the team to play against top teams as we can just brush them aside with poncey football.The scary thing is Arsene will set out the team in exactly the same way against Chelsea away shortly and again we're gonna get stuffed.Bellerin looked a typical Arsene coached player,very talented on the ball but s**t on positioning,tackling and defensive nous.Only 4 premiership games and 1 Champions League game played and we already know we're not gonna win either.Very frigging depressing.

135. reboot

     Sep 17, 2014, 8:54 #57448

     The 200 million in the bank is part of the "new manager fund" being put in place by Arsene Wenger for his successor. He is being a saint and sacrificing glory for himself for the future good of the club. We know this to be true because informed sources have told us so on this very site.

136. Simon

     Sep 17, 2014, 8:39 #57447

     No side has won more games in the Champions League without winning the competition than Arsenal. A more astute manager would have won it several times with the players that Wenger had at his disposal during the Highbury years. We just look so slow across the whole pitch and considering we have a new fitness guru the players look even less fit than ever. We have conceded 8 goals this season, 2 have come from our inability to defend a corner and 5 have come from us being in an attacking position. Is there not a single individual at the club who can see this? As nice as it was winning the FA cup all it has done has led to another 3 years of a manager who is 8 years past his sell by date. I fear it's going to be a long and painful season, but hey let's not get too down as Arsene knows!!!

137. Mark

     Sep 17, 2014, 8:39 #57446

     Ripped apart last night, plain and simple. It was hard to watch, if only because we had no clue how to deal with a team that performed the same way they have the last 2 occasions we've played there. 2-0 flattered us severely, it was a proper hiding. The only enjoyable moment came at the end when Szczesny came out, cleared the ball and nailed their player in the process. Says it all really

138. Angry & Frustrated

     Sep 17, 2014, 8:35 #57445

     Not commented on this site for ages, simply because we have all been going round in circles for years now, with the exact same observations. At the end of the day this club will never challenge for the title or CL with Wenger at the helm. His one dimensional approach to every single game regardless who the opposition is quite frankly now well beyond embarrassing. Last time I did post, I suggested that you could pick up any comment I and many others have made from 5 years ago and they would be as relevant then as they remain now. Nothing has changed, apart from a relatively fluky FA Cup win, which should have been the moment for Wenger to bow out. However as we know to our cost, his ego and greed for the easy money with no pressure from above, meant he signed a new lucrative contract. The board realized it was safe for them to now offer it to him once the trophy drought was over, and they could now get back to the real business model at Arsenal which is to fleece the fans of money, with a clueless second rate manager. With the I will jump off a cliff if Wenger tells me to disciples helping to prop up this totally out of date manager, the AKB’s have given us all another three years of this total and utter sh**e. I can’t speak for others, but having been a Gooner for more years than I care to remember, one thing I do know, and that is you know deep down inside if your team is in with a realistic shout of the really big prizes, and when it’s not! I haven’t had that gut feeling now for nearly a decade, which for a club of our size and stature says it all. I remain convinced that a tactically astute manager can get more out of these same players than Wenger can, particularly against quality opposition teams. Especially so if in the next window the priority is focussed 100% on acquiring quality defensive type players, coupled with an actual plan B and hopefully C, D and E as well!!Last night’s game was just yet another example of the vicious cycle we find ourselves in, because no doubt they will improve to get to the last 16, and probably end up finishing fourth once more in the league. Should that once again happen (or should I say when!) I will simply copy and paste this very comment, and add it to an article in one year’s time to prove my point once more to the deluded AKB’s, who are propping up this tactically bereft manager of ours, condemning us all to this never ending nightmare of no hope!